Tuesday, October 28, 2008

Another Way to View Obama's "Distribution of Wealth"

I didn't write this, but felt like reposting it as I feel it takes a very basic approach to what "Distribution of Wealth" means in its practical application.

Today on my way to lunch I passed a homeless guy with a sign that read "Vote Obama, I need the money." I laughed.

Once in the restaurant my server had on a "Obama 08" tie, again I laughed as he had given away his political preference--just imagine the coincidence.

When the bill came I decided not to tip the server and explained to him that I was exploring the Obama redistribution of wealth concept. He stood there in disbelief while I told him that I was going to redistribute his tip to someone who I deemed more in need--the homeless guy outside. The server angrily stormed from my sight.

I went outside, gave the homeless guy $10 and told him to thank the server inside as I've decided he could use the money more. The homeless guy was grateful.

At the end of my rather unscientific redistribution experiment I realized the homeless guy was grateful for the money he did not earn, but the waiter was pretty angry that I gave away the money he did earn.

I guess redistribution of wealth is an easier thing to swallow in concept than in practical application...


Anonymous said...

Regardless, this was the right thing to do. If we relied on the waiter to give the homeless guy money, he would starve....because lets face it, the waiter needs his pot!

Des said...

Maybe true about the waiter... ;-)

HOWEVER, I disagree about people not giving. America is one of the most generous countries in the entire world... I'm sure that homeless man got more than just that $10 on that day.

mbriscoe said...

I hate putting "blogs" within comments, and I have posted this before, but it fits so nicely with what you said, I just had to throw it in there!

Suppose that every day, ten men go out for beer and the bill for all ten comes to $100. If they paid their bill the way we pay our taxes, it would go something like this:

The first four men (the poorest) would pay nothing.

The fifth would pay $1.

The sixth would pay $3.

The seventh would pay $7.

The eighth would pay $12.

The ninth would pay $18.

The tenth man (the richest) would pay $59.

So, that's what they decided to do. The ten men drank in the bar every day and seemed quite happy with the arrangement, until one day, the owner threw them a curve. 'Since you are all such good customers, he said, 'I'm going to reduce the cost of your daily beer by $20. Drinks for the ten now cost just $80.

The group still wanted to pay their bill the way we pay our taxes so the first four men were unaffected. They would still drink for free. But what
about the other six men - the paying customers? How could they divide the $20 windfall so that everyone would get his 'fair share?'

They realized that $20 divided by six is $3.33. But if they subtracted that from everybody's share, then the fifth man and the sixth man would each end
up being paid to drink his beer. So, the bar owner suggested that it would be fair to reduce each man's bill by roughly the same amount, and he
proceeded to work out the amounts each should pay.

And so:
The fifth man, like the first four, now paid nothing (100% savings).

The sixth now paid $2 instead of $3 (33%savings).

The seventh now paid $5 instead of $7 (28%savings).

The eighth now paid $9 instead of $12 (25% savings).

The ninth now paid $14 instead of $18 (22% savings).

The tenth now paid $49 instead of $59 (16% savings).

Each of the six was better off than before And the first four continued to drink for free. But once outside the restaurant, the men began to compare
their savings.

'I only got a dollar out of the $20', declared the sixth man.

He pointed to the tenth man,' but he got $10!'

'Yeah, that's right', exclaimed the fifth man. I only saved a dollar, too.
It's unfair that he got ten times more than I!'

'That's true!!' shouted the seventh man. 'Why should he get $10 back when I got only two? The wealthy get all the breaks!'

'Wait a minute,' yelled the first four men in unison. 'We didn't get anything at all. The system exploits the poor!'

The nine men surrounded the tenth and beat him up. The next night the tenth man didn't show up for drinks, so the nine sat down and had beers without him. But when it came time to pay
the bill, they discovered something important. They didn't have enough money between all of them for even half of the bill!

And that, boys and girls, journalists and college professors, is how our tax system works. The people who pay the highest taxes get the most benefit from a tax reduction. Tax them too much, attack them for being wealthy, and they just may not show up anymore.
David R. Kamerschen, Ph.D.

For those who understand, no explanation is needed.
For those who do not understand, no explanation is possible.

Brad Shull said...

Ha! This is funny coming from an X Church Employee. I bet you liked redistribution of wealth then! hahahahahahahha. Im BACK!

Mel said...

Good post Des & Mbriscoe! The left & liberals just look at things differently... they EXPECT the GOVERNMENT to totally take care of us and us conservatives believe it's our job to take care of ourselves, our families and our fellow man thru the means that God has given us to steward individually. Like the parable of the talants. What did each do with theirs? God didn't say, what did your governing authority do with your money you handed over to them to redistribute, but what did YOU do with what I gave you!

As far as anonymous and the waiter thing, it was never said it was the waiter's job to give the money to the homeless guy. That homeless guy has shelter provided for him thru church and city programs and IF he really wanted to help himself, he could get his own job and make his own money and then help others that used to be like him, instead of just asking for handouts! I totally agree Des, we are one of the givingest countries on Earth, America's people, to the poor and needy! If big government would quit taking more of our money, we could give even more to whoever or whatever cause we wanted.

And Brad, I'm guessing you were just kidding about the X Church employee thing? Otherwise your comment sounded kinda mean and I know you have a good heart! :) There's a teddy bear under that growl, I just know it :)

Des said...

I am super confused Brad, or maybe you are. How does the fact that I used to work at a church make me like redistribution of wealth? I was taxed just like anyone else... there is no tax break for church employees unless you are a pastor. Yous till pay taxes, but there is a clause that allows you to claim a housing allowance... but that's like telling you that you like distribution of wealth because you have 2 kids and get a tax credit for it... makes no sense Brad and seriously, you always make it personal, and I try to never do that with you as I know it offends you so easily. So keep your comments neutral or don't comment.

Brad Shull said...

Guys! That was totally was a joke and sounded so funny in my head.

I wasn't talking about taxes, I was talking about how Church Employess get paid. Its a form of "Distribution of Wealth". People Tithe and it Gets Distributed. Get it... no?

I will stop leaving comments because I don't think I can be Neutral, thats really boring.

(said in a happy go lucky tone)

Anonymous said...

Hey, all! This is Britten just for the record :) Okay, gotta hit on Brad's comment about church workers receiving a "redistribution of wealth". In my mind its nowhere CLOSE to being the same thing...people choose to give tithes and offerings, they aren't legally required to give!! Taxes are imposed without any form of choice whatsoever, our only say in the matter is the President we pick. I just don't see how you could consider it the same thing...whether its a business or a church, employees are paid for a service. They're paid for the WORK they perform, they aren't given monetary hand-outs for doing nothing...and people don't HAVE to pay them if they don't want to. They have the choice to pick from whatever church or business they care to associate with, and that employee is paid for their services. Redistribution of wealth, means you take money from someone who's earned it..and give it to someone else, its the very basis of socialism and its a dangerous practice!! Now I believe we SHOULD pay taxes to a certain degree, however I don't think that increasing taxes, especially in the situation we find ourselves today, is going to help anyone!! Considering the phrases and terms Obama has used to explain his tax policy, I for one am very concerned with what we may be looking at for the next few years...it honestly scares me. Keep in mind, the wonderful tax breaks we HAVE had under the Bush administration WILL expire during the next administration, and Obama has repeatedly said he won't renew them!! If you think things are difficult now...just wait and see, there is no way his policy will work!! Just my opinion...

Brad Shull said...

That makes since. I totally take back my first two comments.

Brad Shull said...

Thats me being Neutral.

Riley said...

Nice. Good words, people. I only take exception to one thing. I understand the fight against Obama for 100 reasons. However, I think we place FAR more power in the president's hands than he really has. Congress is just as important!

The further truth seems to me that you only need 5 men to rule this nation. No need to let Congress write the law when the Supreme Court gets to define it. So Obama wants Roe V. Wade overturned, and there are 2 justices waiting for the new president to take office so that they can (hopefully) be replaced with Obama's picks instead of Bush's.

Presidents don't write or interpret the law. Get involved in your congressional votes. It's really important! President is just the guy that the world thinks is in power, but we are concerned with the Fed, Congress, Secretary of the Treasury, Supreme Court, etc.

In truth, I think that Paulson, Pelosi, and Bernanke all have more power than the president, but with the pending justices situation, I do agree that NObama is of incredible importance.

BTW, did you hear that there is an open court case challenging his ability to be elected or serve as president? Evidently he has failed to produce sufficient evidence to prove that he is a natural born citizen! We'll see how that goes....

Speaking of which... What happens if he wins the electoral college vote only to be proven unfit for presidency? Is it Biden? Or is he considered unfit to run and recieve no electoral votes? Would it then be McCain (as the second highest number of votes in the election)?

Anybody know?


AW said...

Okay, so...What if the sign was held by a pregnant girl and it said:

"VOTE OBAMA and I will be keep this baby, because I will afford to feed it!!"

What if that $10 went to the poor young mom who is now able to KEEP her baby????

Huh, huh?? what about THAT? =)

Des said...

Well no one gave me a handout when I was pregnant with my daughter with no insurance because I didn't "qualify" for government assistance. Some people helped out because of the goodness of their hearts, but I was still stuck with over $10,000 in medical bills.
Children don't always come at convenient times when you have all your ducks in a row... so I would say, suck it up and stop looking for the government to solve all of your problems! I did.

Anonymous said...

As a business owner who employs 30 people, I have resigned myself to the fact that Barack Obama, will be our next President, and that my taxes and fees will go up in a BIG way.

To compensate for these increases, I figure, that the customer will have to see an increase in my charges to them of about 8%. I will also have to lay off 6 of my employees. This really bothered me, as I believe we are family here. I didn't know how to choose who will have to go. So this is what I did. I strolled through the parking lot and found 8 Obama bumper stickers on my employees cars. I have decided these folks will be the first to be laid off.

I can't think of another fair way to approach this problem. If you have a better idea, let me know. I am sending this letter to all business owners that I know.


Anonymous said...

You are privledged...you have a job and your husband has a job...the fact that you can afford school and a home tells us that!

So, you cannot compare yourself to the person in the example.

Anonymous said...

'Twas the night before elections
And all through the town
Tempers were flaring
Emotions all up and down!

I, in my bathrobe
With a dog in my lap
Had cut off the TV
Tired of political crap.

When all of a sudden
There arose such a noise
I peered out of my window
And saw Obama and his boys

They had come for my wallet
They wanted my pay
To give it to the others
Who had not worked a day!

He snatched up my money
And quick as a flash
Jumped back on his bandwagon
With all of my stash

He then rallied his henchmen
Who were pulling his cart
I could tell they were out
To tear my country apart!

'On Fannie, on Freddie,
On Biden and Ayers!
On Acorn, On Pelosi'
He screamed at the pairs!

They took off for his cause
And as he flew out of sight
I heard him laugh at the nation
That wouldn't stand up and fight!

So I leave you to think
On this one final note-

Anonymous said...

Hey just because someone lives in a home doesn't mean they can afford it!


Des said...

I take offense to that. You come talk to me about it when you are stuck with over $10,000 in medical bills no matter what your income was. During this time, my husband and I combined weren't making that much, but it was more than the paltry amount the government says we can make (which for a 3 person family is something like less than $24,000 a year combined).
I was lucky enough that my parents paid for my schooling and yes we have a small house, but I am only paying a few hundred dollars more a month for it than I was for a 2 bedroom apartment. Just because I have a good job and my husband has a good job doesn't mean I am privileged.
And yes, I agree with the last comment. Owning a home has nothing to do with status in this country anymore. We had a 100% loan and put no money down as we didn't have money to put down even if we wanted to. Thankfully we didn't get trapped in an ARM loan or we would be right there with the millions of other Americans in foreclosure as our payments went sky high because of interest rates.
So whether you think it or not, I was there and it was one of the hardest times in our life that we are STILL paying off almost 2 years later.
Yet we did it and not only did we get through it but we bettered ourselves because of it and learned a lot of things along the way. We are better financially and otherwise because of what we learned during that time. So my answer still stands.

Anonymous said...

really? was it that bad? because aren't you about to do it all again?

you eat everyday, you have your basic needs AND your luxuries.

you are in fact, priviledged.

the fact that we are sitting on the computer contributing to this blog means we are priviledged.

Mel said...

Wow - we have some good dialogues going on here :)

Depends on what definition of "priviledged" someone is talking about... there's many levels of priviledge! Just being alive and breathing is one priviledge we have every day!

Someone owning a home doesn't mean they are rich, just means they are hard working people who pay for where they live. They have earned the right to own a home by their hard work. It's called capitalism! Doesn't mean they are "rich & priviledged". If you have to rent, you are still "priviledged" if you want to look at it that way b/c you get to stay in a nice place, whether you own it or not! With some analogy on here, living in a homeless shelter could be a "privilege" b/c poor people living in the dumps in Mexico have to live among trash instead of a place that has running water and hot meals!

Des being able to sit at a computer doesn't make her priviledged... she's worked hard to pay for the computer and bought it with their money...aka they "EARNED IT"...

McCain/Palin - the team RIGHT for our country! Letting us keep more of our hard earned money to be good stewards of it in whatever way God leads us!

Mel said...

by the way Brad... I'm very happy to hear you were kidding with what you posted :)

Funny how we read it in our heads... makes all the difference in the world!

Des said...

I guess we'll have to play semantics another time "anonymous", but just to clarify, this time around thankfully we have insurance so no, not about to go down the same road which will help my "privileged" status even more.

Anonymous said...

republicans. ick.

Des said...

FYI this blog is written by and largely read by Republicans. I wouldn't come here if you are interested in a more liberal take on things. Not gonna happen and you will be continually frustrated after reading any political post :)

Mel said...

Why is it that liberals seem to want to just argue and say mean things? Is it for the adreneline rush that goes with it? Seriously... if you just like to argue... ask yourself why?

Des... I LOVE your blogs... you are one intelligent girl, who is very well spoken and lays her case out with soundness and flair! sooooooo.... you GO girl!!! Woot!

Anonymous said...

Im not repub. or dem. im not sure what i am, but i love your blogs
Jenny Herringotn

Brad Shull said...

The comments on this blog truly make me sick to my stomach! (from both sides)

Maybe its because I've been in a city all week that has been truly devestated. People are still waiting for help and they are not getting it! Old Widows are living in FEMA trailers because thier houses are covered in Black mold from being underwater and sewage for a month.

Melanie, your comment about poor people getting jobs and helping themselves just blows me away. I truly and honestly do not understand you.

Everyone needs to look in thier hearts and find some Grace. Drop all your politicle/religious BS and do whats right.

Get out your Bible and read what Jesus has to say about wealth and whats it worth. Read the stories of how he lived among the poor and healed them and feed them and took care of them.

Des said...

lol, oh Brad. Gotta love you.
I think what Melanie was saying was that the average person on welfare probably doesn't HAVE to be and should indeed go out and get a job. I don't think she is referring to the elderly on medicare at all. They can't go get a job and most of them have paid into social security their entire lives and are literally owed be the government.
I agree though and am thankful for organizations that I give my money to monthly and have in the past volunteered(though not in 2008- we still give monthly but I haven't been able to volunteer) my time to that help people like this woman, but in our own communities as well as New Orleans.
I'm glad it's inspired you to do something extra though! It really is a Biblical mandate. My dad raised us to:
1. Always tithe 10% to your local congregation;
2. Always give to organizations that help the poor, widowed and needy; and
3. Always give to organizations that bless Israel.
I so believe in that and think every believer should do the same! even if you can't get out and volunteer every weekend, at least give financially.

Brad Shull said...

I looks like you have it all figured out Des. Lucky you.

I hope your security blanket is always in tact.

oh, I know im not supposed to show my true feelings on your blog, but the "LOL, oh brad, gotta love you" was very patronizing. I don't really think I deserve that.

Mel said...

To understand me is to follow Christ's teaching... that's what I believe in and that's what I do! I too give each month to churchs & organizations that one of their main purposes is to literally take food & clothing to the needy in our areas and in Mexico and orphans all over the world. I have a very compassionate heart full of mercy and grace. Jesus was about healing, forgiving, restoring, mercy & grace. He loved people no matter who they were or what status they had.

Thanks Des ... you understand me quite well and thanks for taking up for me and clarifying what I was trying to say. You are totally correct in your assessment! I have great compassion for especially the poor & elderly. Alot of the homeless people on the street however, are there b/c of their poor choices in life and have that potential or had it early on, to turn themselves around and help themselves to at least put shelter over their own heads and feed themselves like the rest of us. That's not always the case, but still true in many. Even illegal immigrants come to America to work or have the opportunity to work, not for the government to take care of them!

As far as New Orleans, doesn't it make more sense that the Mayor of New Orleans and local government people have let them down by not staying on FEMA or whomever it is that needs to help them after all this time? I'm sure millions of dollars was allocated to them from the government to help them after the hurricane. I don't know enough about the situation now to speak freely on this, so I won't say much more, but it IS sad that they are all still suffering! Habitat for Humanity should be in there building new homes too!

Galveston was devastated just recently and I believe our State and local governments are getting the job done here in Texas for them?

My view is that the Federal Government is not the means to all ends and we should never expect them to be our almighty provider for everything. Elderly should be taken care of by Social Security... that's what it was setup for and what they paid into! We are all in this together and there's MANY ways to help each other, not just relying on big government.

Brad - I still love ya, even though we've never met, and disagree politically on LOTS of issues! By the way... I voted today... and yes... probably cancelled out your vote :)

Des said...

I don't have it all figured out. I was agreeing with you on the needing to get out and do something and I'm glad you are going to start. That's a really good thing!
And I really do love you! I love that you are so passionate about things. It's not a bad trait to be passionate at all. Too many people are apathetic to life and it is boring. Though we don't always agree, I will always appreciate your passion. (PS. I really wasn't meaning to be patronizing, but instead it was a tone of endearment, for reals).

Brad Shull said...

Once again Melanie, your comment leaves me completely dumbfounded.

And your right. You don't know me.

Anonymous said...

Wow, there are SO many comments I want to touch on!! But, I'm going to try to make this short and sweet :) Okay, Brad, I don't think you should leave, I think its great to have a healthy debate and keep everyone thinking, although I have to agree with Destiny here, you still sound angry! I'm confused as to why?? I think the reason everyone is continuing to comment is to discuss these important issues!! I'm glad to hear that you are anti-abortion (HUGE in my opinion) and I see how the current economic situation is scaring people...I just got a wonderful announcement today thats left me in shock, and I'm still processing the whole thing...but I have to agree with Riley here. Our Congress is FAR more to blame right now than our President...we, as a country were doing WONDERFUL up until two years ago!! Since then gas prices have sky-rocketed, the stock market has looked like a very bad joke, and people are losing their homes right and left!! So, now that we've SEEN and EXPERIENCED what having the democrats in Congress has done, HOW can you vote to put in a President who will simply expedite the demise thats been created?? Are you saying that financially you can handle losing your child credit rebates (I saw that you have two kiddos, gorgeous btw), the tax breaks we've received under Bush, AND handle a tax INCREASE on your finances?? If thats so, then you are blessed far beyond most Americans today...I for one am barely making it as it is...and don't see how Obama is going to make it better!! Again, I believe who we vote for as President is important, but it will not single-handedly wrap up the current national problems we're dealing with right now...it WILL make a difference in the direction our nation will go in the future and THATS why I think its so important.

To "aw", last time I checked there are SO MANY different organizations that will help a soon-to-be single Mom!! Not to mention an overwhelming amount of loving homes desperately wanting a baby to raise as their own...if that girl can't find one then she isn't looking!! So sorry, but anyone willing to write anything like that on a sign isn't looking for help, shes looking for an excuse to get out of her situation!!

Des, totally hear you on the pregnancy thing...and (THANK YOU LORD) Bush had just passed the law that required insurance companies to cover pregnancy in a "pre-existing" condition across the board, or I would probably still be paying off Ethan's birth! He was an unexpected addition, and I've never been so relieved in my life :) EVERYONE falls on hard times in life, and needs a helping hand, sometimes the government can and should help. However, sitting at home continuing to play the martyr never helped anyone! And I don't think the rest of the country should be required to pay for someone else who refuses to help themselves!!

I am SO enjoying this..and the anonymous who posted the rhyme, my sister and I laughed SO hard..thanks for the laugh ;)

P.S. This is Britten again...

Anonymous said...

FYI, that was my version of "short and sweet" ;)


Just passing thru... said...

Des....Great blog.
You're very articulate.

I also admire how you take the high road when making your points, and not resort to personal jabs or snide diminutive remarks. I can respect that.

And I'm voting opposite from you. :)

Des said...

well thanks, but I feel like I've been a bit more jabby in this blog than I usually am. I think I'm fiestier on bed rest due to too much time on my hands!

Brad Shull said...

The Democrats have been in congress for 2 of President Bush's 8 year term. He had 6 years of a Republican majority house and Senate. So I don't blame them for what is going on right now.

Brad Shull said...

and the reason I am so angry was answered in an earlier blog of Destiny's. Apparently its because my father didn't love me enough.

Brad Shull said...

To all intelligent people.....

Please do some research so you don't believe that it is the Congress's fault for gas prices going up and for the Stock market crashing.

Do you really believe that Britten??? I am not being angry, I am just letting you know that you are completely misinformed.

Des said...

Congress didn't make gas prices go up, however they could have approved requests to make SOME of our oil reserve available to help lower our gas prices. Though I don't think I would have agreed with that.
Secondly, the reason why our stock market crashed for the most part is because of the housing market crashing and all of the fallout regarding that. The housing market crashing is in effect due to the legislation passed by Congress.
You don't have to be rude Brad.
And almost everyone gets their information by doing research and cut and pasting it. You do it and I do it too. None of us are experts.

Des said...

But yes Brad, you are right in the general sense as Congress didn't have a direct effect on that. But legislation has an effect on everything so I can't fully agree with either of you.

Brad Shull said...

But when people post Ideas as facts it gets dangerous Destiny, because others believe it.

I apologize for being rude Britten. I just want people to know the truth about both sides.

Des said...

well it's a good thing this blog is just based on people's personal opinion and not being quoted on the AP news ticker.

Anonymous said...

My point was missed, once again...the whole origional blog was to argue by comparison, so my response with the pregnant lady was to illustrate that the well being of a lazy, jobless, free loader is more important to "YOU" if she is pregnant....you care more about the life of the UNBORN than the ADULT...sadly, this child will STATISTICALLY be a "free loader" as well (i hate this terminology, but i am trying to make a point using the perspective I have seen on the preceding comments)

- AW